Rick Chafey, Red Rock Pools and Spas: Now's the Best Time to be a Pool Owner (interview by David Brake).

http://www.buildredrock.com/
Topics include:

• How the economy makes this the best time to be a pool owner
• Value of the IntelliFlo Pool Pump

- -  Please see below for a text version of this audio file. - - 

David Brake:        

We’re visiting today with Rick Chafey of Red Rock Pool and Spas in Gilbert, Arizona. Rick is a water shape designer and builder who, among other projects, has been involved with the Arizona Fantasy Pool, which you can see highlighted on the Innovation Lab. Rick, welcome to Innovation Lab. Thanks for taking some time with us today.

Rick Chafey:        

Good to be here, Dave. Thank you.

David Brake:        

So tell me about the life of a water shape designer and builder for those regular pool owners out there who may not recognize that industry specific term. What do you do, Rick?

Rick Chafey:        

What we get to do is really take our passions and put them out into the field. We started out as a construction company and turned ourselves into a design/build water feature and water shape builder. When you live in a place like Arizona, you – that’s what everybody does is spend their time in their backyard. That’s what sells the houses. That’s what people take photographs of when they’re putting their house up for sale. That’s what you see at every resort picture brochure is what, you know, the pools and the swimming areas and the resort style stuff. And that’s what we started to grow upon in our business and it really became what was our passion. So we just were – the benefit we have now is what I do for a living is what I love to do and then most of the people that we build for love what we do as well. It’s a really great position to be in, especially in the locale that we’re in with the swim days that we have for almost the entire year.

David Brake:        

Well Rick, I’ve had the opportunity to actually be with you and spend some time with you at the Arizona Fantasy Pool and I will tell you that it rivals many resorts that I’ve been to. I get the feeling that you may have designed that with a resort in mind. Can you tell us about the story behind that pool?

Rick Chafey:        

The Fantasy Pool we built in Arizona, it’s probably one of our funnest projects because the first thing we did when we met with the customer was have them kind of explain to us the few resorts that they remember going to, both in Arizona and other parts of the world for that matter, and you know, sat us down saying we want that sort of setting in our own backyard because as much as we do travel we prefer to, when we’re not traveling, to have those same benefits. And so we, me and my partner, sat with that couple the first time and we’re, you know, kind of in awe with the request they were making because they were asking us to fit a resort pool in their backyard. And they have a large yard, but really, you know, they just kept listing the stuff they want and all those things are pieces and parts that we’ve done at resorts or that we’ve done at some pools, but they kind of listed all of those and said, “We want this in our backyard. We want it to fit. We want it to, you know, feel like it belongs here.”

But at the same time they want to be able to walk out and feel – and be hidden in their backyard and engulfed in this whole resort. And so that little – that project for us was kind of a pinnacle of where we’ve started. We were able to take a lot of the pieces and parts we’ve built as a company and built for other people and tie them all together in one backyard and have more flexibility, too. Resorts and commercial projects get restrict some of the code requirements, but in a residential setting, for this type of client, we were able to do a ton of things that we wouldn’t normally be able to pull off and make that backyard such an incredible destination. And you can see from the videos, and even that probably you could say doesn’t give it justice because you’ve been there, but when you walk in and sit in that backyard you are in one of the nicest resort settings you could ever feel and you’re sitting in somebody’s backyard.

David Brake:        

Well it’s an amazing environment and I encourage our listeners to visit the Innovation Lab and learn more about it. Rick, I would imagine that if you’re spending that kind of money, if a homeowner is making that kind of an investment in their yard and pool, some people may not think that they’re concerned about energy efficiency, but I understand that, you know, this pool was actually built with sustainability and energy efficiency in mind. Can you tell us a little bit about that?

Rick Chafey:        

Absolutely. You know, in any given pool project there’s a certain amount of excess, maybe, that takes away from it. But when you try to do a project this size, and especially with a company like ours, our main focus is to be able to pull it off as efficiently and as effectively as possible within – you know, sustainability in mind as well. And you sometimes have more benefit when you have a client willing to spend money because you can do some of these things – or not everybody thinks they can afford, but this customer walks in and says, “This is how we want it, you know, but how can we do that effectively?” And we’re able to take in a ton of the newer, you know, technologies that really save customers money long term in the operation of the pool, but also aren’t really that expensive to invest in the beginning and really add to the value in that pool because it’s quieter, it functions better and it’s more efficient overall.

And especially on a huge project, too, you really need to take energy efficiency into mind because at some level there’s only so much energy available to that site; especially in a residential setting. We don’t have some of the power abilities, so it really needs to be designed that way just to work on the site. But if you take all those into play and work with the customers, you can design a huge pool project with all kinds of different options and still have it be, you know, fairly energy efficient or very energy efficient for that matter. And this was one of those projects.

We pushed the limits with every piece of energy efficiency we could and every product that was available to us from Pentair with variable frequency drive pumps like their IntelliFlo pumps, LED lighting systems, and then the automation system that allows us to properly control all those. And that all kind of adds up and gives you both a good operating pool, a very efficient project and also lets you minimize some of the energy to build the pool because you’re going to be able to minimize the number of pumps and many other things that variable frequency drive and IntelliFlo systems allow.

David Brake:        

Rick, this might be a good opportunity for you to explain to our listeners exactly how the IntelliFlo pool pump works. You obviously have worked with these. You’ve installed a lot of them. In layman’s terms, help us understand what this is and what it does.

Rick Chafey:        

The beauty of this pump is it’s essentially a pump that can be anything from a quarter horsepower to three horsepower in one pump. So one just gives you a massive amount of flexibility on how much water it can move and at what speed it moves it. Two, just in the – because of the type of construction in the pump, and I won’t go into the real details of it, but just because of the type of magnet system it uses it is 30% more efficient than any pump on the market at any given speed. So if you set this pump to be similar to a one horsepower pump, any other pump on the market will use 30% more energy. So just by installing that pump simply that way, you’re going to save no less than 30% on the operation of the pump.

But the other benefit to this pump, which is actually the biggest, probably one of the bigger green things about it or more efficient things about it is I can use one pump to run at multiple speeds to do multiple things. So I can take a single pump that can be my filter pump. I can also, when I need to, use that pump to be my filter pump and my waterfall pump just by speeding it up. I can use that same pump to then be a spa jet pump with a push of a few buttons. And so if you automate the system and use a pump like this, this one little pump that takes up the space of a single pump can actually do three, four, five or six jobs; depending on the project. And that alone kind of gives you a massive amount of flexibility. It takes less space. It allows us to, you know, use less energy to create the products that built that pool in the first place, which makes it more sustainable and less of a drag on the environment.

But then that same pump allows us to operate the pool the most efficiently we’d ever want to operate it. When you design a pool system, even a basic little backyard pool, you know, you overdesign the pump system to make sure it, you know, is doing more than your normal turnover rate so that you’re meeting the minimum requirements. But in doing so, with the safety factors involved and the hydraulic design, you’re going to overbuild that pool to a certain extent; even if you do a very good job of calculating it. With a variable frequency pump, once the pool’s constructed we can actually dial the pump into the exact parameters of what we need. So we might design and come out with a design standard saying we need a one and a half horsepower pump, so that’s how we build the pool. Once the pool’s built, turned on and constructed, we can then find out what our flow needs are or what our flow actually is and actually ramp that pump down to that exact speed. And so now we might be able to cut 70-80% of that – I mean 60 to 70% of that actual flow out of the pool because we overbuilt it to that size. So a pool that’s got a one and a half horsepower pump design might only need three-quarters of horsepower, so that’s all we have to run.

And then there’s some hydraulic laws that come into effect, and just by slowing stuff down we usually get almost a four time payback in loss of friction. So if you take a one horsepower pump and run 100 gallons a minute through it, if you can slow that down to half that speed you’re going to save four to eight times as much on the energy to do that. It’s almost endless. I could talk for days on the benefits you receive from using that type of pump. And we’ve started using them even on smaller projects and bigger projects right when they first came out because we’ve seen the technology used in other types of projects; not within swimming pools. But it’s really just started to take off, you know, a little more and more here. But it’s probably the most effective technology for any type of pumping system there is.

David Brake:        

So, Rick, I guess what I’m hearing you say is this is not just for the Arizona Fantasy Pool and resort pools and very high end pools, but a more modest backyard pool this is something that can save the pool owner money as well.

Rick Chafey:        

Absolutely. We, you know, I think the concept is because it’s a more expensive pump it seems like most pool builders kind of set that aside for the higher end pools, but the reality is, although it is moderately more expensive than your average pool pump, the short upfront cost that you pay gets far outweighed by the long term benefits. So in our business that’s the only pump we use. There is times we use horsepower specific pumps for specific projects, but every pool that we’ve ever built since that pump’s been available utilizes that pump; no matter what the size of the project. Even what we would call a spool, which is just an oversized spa, that pump the upfront cost is so minimal in relation to what benefit you’re going to get in long term energy savings, longevity of the pool system and just the efficiency of how everything functions, the quietness of the pump. I mean there’s so many benefits to that pump.

It surprises me that every knowledgeable, educated pool builder doesn’t have that as a base standard in every pool. And hopefully consumers become more educated and start asking, even on their base model pools, to get that pump installed because it will save them energy and pay itself back in a very short amount of time; sometimes less than two years. So that little upfront cost can easily be taken care of immediately.

David Brake:        

Well let’s talk about that typical consumer for a moment, but let’s say that we’re talking about a consumer who has a pool that’s 20 years old. Just a nice, typical backyard pool; if there’s such a thing as a typical backyard pool. How do I know if I need the IntelliFlo? How do I know that it will save me money? What would your advice to me be to explore this further?

Rick Chafey:        

Pentair’s website has a great little calculator you can go in and kind of put in what parameters your current pool has. And then type in how long you’re running your pump, what size your pump is. It’ll immediately kind of kick out the energy savings you can benefit from this pump. So even if, and again, even if you didn’t use the ability to control it and slow things down and program it and just put the pump in and ran it the same amount of timeframe you’re currently running it, you’d save 30% on your utility bill. And when you look at a home utility bill, even in Arizona where air conditioning’s a huge part of our bill, your pool pump is your number two most energy user on your system on your house. So that’s the key ingredient we want to look at is which items save us the most amount of money. We don’t need to make the toaster more efficient because we use it once a month. We need to make the pool pump that runs eight hours a day or six hours a day more efficient.

The IntelliFlo can be added to any existing pool by swapping out the pump. It can be programmed to meet the existing pool parameters, both plumbing and pipe size, drain system, skimmer system and volume just with a few parameters with the installer and you’ve immediately created a 30% decrease in your energy bill and likely can save 70 to 80% right off the bat just by installing that pump. It’s an easy sale or easy buy for any consumer.

David Brake:        

So let’s talk about the consumer who has the pool professional, the service professional come and service their pool; kind of like me, (Joe Kayer) is my pool guy. Comes once a week. Is it something I should ask Joe about? Let’s say that I’m not real mechanically inclined and I don’t necessarily want to take the time to look at all the details myself. Is this something that my pool guy should be able to help me with?

Rick Chafey:        

It definitely is. Most pool guys should be able to help you with that and it’s become a fairly standard practice now to use that pump for a lot of people. If your pool guy doesn’t know how to use it, I’m sure that through the Innovation Lab and with Pentair you can get in contact with somebody in your local area that definitely can handle that pump, because most guys now are fairly educated on that pump and it’s a very simple swap out for a pump guy. And if your pool guy doesn’t know about it and you start feeding him a little bit of information on it, once he finds out about it he can add that – that can be a huge part of his business just changing the current group of people he has on his service contracts to that pump and saving all of his customers money.

David Brake:        

Great. Well we’re visiting with Rick Chafey of Red Rock Pools and Spas in Gilbert, Arizona. You can visit his website at www.buildredrock.com . Rick, I appreciate your time today. Tell me a little bit about the future of the pool industry. We’re kind of in a tough economy right now. Hopefully we’re coming out of it. What do you see as the future of the business that you’re in?

Rick Chafey:        

The future we see is definitely changing drastically day to day and there’s what’s coming around is the best thing for consumers is the fact that now pool builders have had to get back into how important customer service is and quality construction and also energy efficiency. You know, the economy kind of makes all three of those things become very important. You know, two or three years ago people were so busy sometimes you were lucky to get a pool builder on the phone that would show up the next day or the next week or next month to even talk to you. And that created a whole lot of pool builders who just kind of got done what had been done for years and didn’t really worry about quality and customer service.

And really what’s come to fruition now with the change in the economy is customer service is key, energy efficiency is just as important as well as the economy of the cost of the pool or the cost of the pool being efficient. But, you know, those three things have really come back to help feed the consumer into a little more competitive market for the pool construction, but also getting a lot more value in there because of the customer service and the quality of the engineering and design of the pools.

And that’s, you know, Pentair’s done a great job of continuing to feed this market with things that are so much more energy efficient and consumer driven product needs that it’s really helped us be that contractor for our clients. You know, it’s the most important thing for us to get word of mouth clients and repeat clients, and that’s what the economy’s done to the rest of us is it’s kind of weeded out the ones that aren’t doing that already and allowed the ones that were to be very successful and strong. And I think that that’s going to continue through. We’ll see a few more of these pool builders drop out of the market because they aren’t grasping onto those important items, but for the consumer it’s the best thing that could have ever happened because now they’re back to being in control of what’s going on and not just hoping for someone to show up. They’re really getting the option to meet with the right contractor, meet with the right pool designers and really get a quality project.

David Brake:        
Rick, it sounds like you’re telling me now is a good time to be a pool owner.

Rick Chafey:        

Now is the best time to be a pool owner or be looking to build a pool, because you can find some really good contractors, very efficient products and real good value in what you’re buying.

David Brake:        

We’ve been visiting with Rick Chafey of Red Rock Pools and Spas in Gilbert, Arizona. Be sure and visit Rick at his website www.buildredrock.com and on the Innovation Lab the Arizona Fantasy Pool; an example of his handiwork, or I should say his team’s handiwork. Quite an amazing pool. And Rick, very knowledgeable. We really appreciate your time today. Thanks for spending some time with us here in the Innovation Lab.

Rick Chafey:  

Anytime. Thanks.